I'm hoping to weave a baby blanket using 3/2 perle cotton but can not achieve an even tension when tying on my warp.  Warp is 40" wide, 90 " long set at 15 epi on an 8 shaft Macomber.  After warping from the back, threading and slaying, I tied the ends in groups of eight.  But the knots are not holding evenly and I end up with a very uneven tension.  The third attempt was tied very tight, than mop was woven to the point where I could get the warp over the front bar.  I was hoping this would help but it did not. Still too many ends lossened up and I'm getting many skips while trying to weave a tabby.  This is my first time using 3/2.  In the past I have used 5/2 and 8/2 without any issues. Has anyone else experienced this?  Any ideas on what the problem may be?

Comments

Sun, 03/23/2014 - 23:15

SallyE (not verified)

What kind of packing did you use on the warp?

 

 

Mon, 03/24/2014 - 00:05

Sherry Crum

I used sticks only at the recommendation of our studio's instructor. The other times I wove with cotton was on my 8 harness HD and than I used a combination of sticks and paper.

Mon, 03/24/2014 - 00:19

SallyE (not verified)

Sticks should work, so something else must be the problem.

What kind of knot are you using to tie on?

 

Mon, 03/24/2014 - 00:43

Sherry Crum

I'm splitting the 8 ends into two groups of 4 ends, bringing them around th apron rod with one half (4 ends) coming up in the middle of the two groups. Than tying half of a square knot and finishing with a slip knot.

Mon, 03/24/2014 - 01:11

Michael White

Do you have all the heddle hooks, hooked?

Michael

Mon, 03/24/2014 - 01:18

SallyE (not verified)

The problem is your knots, I think.  I've never heard of the method you are describing.

Someone recently described the knot you are supposed to use.  I can't seem to find it, so I'll have to recreate it.   So here goes:

Lay the 8 ends on top of the rod.  Split the 8 ends into two groups of 4.  Pass the groups under the rod and bring them up on each side of the original group of 8 (left 4 on the right side, right 4 on the left side).  Tie an ordinary knot, BUT, instead of tying by passing one group around the other once, do it twice.   This does not mean two knots, it means one knot that is double wrapped, so to speak.  This creates a lot of friction and the knot won't slip.

Now, you can take the two ends (two groups of 4) and pull them toward the reed, and pull them tight to adjust the tension.    Start your knots in the middle of the warp and do two groups.   Advance your cloth beam ratchet two clicks, and tie two more on the left and two on the right.   Tighten two clicks again.   Continue until they are all tied.

 

 

Mon, 03/24/2014 - 01:18

Sherry Crum

Michael, I believe so but I will double check that when I go to the studio in the morning.

Mon, 03/24/2014 - 09:40

Andrew Kieran (not verified)

The way we tie on is as follows.

Step 0

Added at the last minute because I just thought of something. You want to make sure you yarns are passing evenly from back to front of the loom and there are no hanking yarns or loose hanging yarns behind the shafts. To do this, take each group of warp ends before tying on and comb them, with a warp comb if you have one, or just a normal fine toothed hair comb if you don't. Just treat it as if you were combing normal hair. This is very good for getting hanks out.

Step 1

We take the group of warp ends to be tied, then we split them in two. We take both halves over the top of the apron rod, down and back up on the outside. Like Sally's method, this is left on the outside of the left and right to right.

Then we tie the first half of a square knot (or as we call it, a reef knot, it's the same thing).

We then tie the entire warp on in this way. It is usual to start with the sides and then do the rest. You don't need to get the tension perfect just now, we're going to sort that out in the next step.

Step 2

So now the warp is tied on, but it's not evenly tensioned yet.

The next step is to evenly apply tension to the entire warp, one bunch of ends at a time. To do this, you first start with the rightmost (or leftmost) bunch of warp ends and you pull them quite tight (not so much you snap them, but really quite tight). I find the best way to do this is to gather up the loose tails coming from the knot in one hand, and the warp ends coming from the reed to the rod in the other and pull on both at once.

Once this is done, tighten up the knot. Still only the first half of the reef knot.

So, this is our standard, the bunch that has the correct tension. We are now going to tension the rest of the warp so it matches this rightmost bunch.

So, working from right to left (or left to right, if you prefer) take each bunch of threads and tighten them up, but before tightening the knot, make sure that the tension is reasonably even with the rightmost bout. Always the rightmost bout for tension comparison.

The reason for this is that people will have a tendency to either over tighten or under tighten a knot when attempting to get it evenly tensioned. It doesn't cause any noticeable difference when compared between one and the other, but if you had 40 bunches of threads in a warp and you always tensioned against the neighbour which had last been tied, you can see that by the time you got to the other side, the warp would have either tightened up or loosened off (more likely the former).

Anyway, now we have our warp tensioned to our satisfaction

Step 3

Finally, go from right to left and tie the second half of the square knot. And tie it tight, as tight as you can. If you are using slippy yarn, tie a third knot, just to be sure. Do this on each bunch of warp ends and you'll be ready to weave.

Mon, 03/24/2014 - 09:56

ReedGuy

What happens when tying on is the first ends always go slack as tension increases on the tie-on rod. So they have to always be retightened. What is recommended is to divide the 8 ends in two. The left bunch of 4 go under the rod, the other over the top. The 4 that went under are wrapped twice around the ones over the top and pulled taut so the wrapped ends rest at the edge of the rod facing the breast beam. There is no knot yet, it just secures the ends until they are all tied. You begin in the middle of the warp and tie 4 to 6 bunches, then go the the sides and tie 4 bunches each. And then work evenly like this on the ends and middle as you continue securing the ends. Then go back over the groups and snug them up again, as some will go slack due to changes in tension. Then you make the final knot by taking the ends that went over the top of the rod in your right hand, and knot that around the bunch that went under. That way both the bottom and top bunches are wrapped. If only one or the other get wrapped, the knot will not hold, it will certainly slip. Tying on requires three steps to be successful. It's a lot quicker and better that untying slack knots, often requiring a needle to open the knots.

 

Mon, 03/24/2014 - 10:26

Sherry Crum

Thanks so much for all the help with tying on!  I always understood the importance of a consistent tension but didn't know all the little tricks to tying on properly.  I'll give it another go when I get back to the studio tommorrow.  Today is devoted to errands and some housekeeping.  Hate it when life interferes with my weaving time ... sigh.  :-)