Hello all,

I have a 24" rigid heddle loom.  I haven't used it in many years, since I also have a floor loom, which is so much easier to get good tension on.  However, I really need two looms going now, so I'm trying to get the tension better on the rigid heddle loom.

The problem with the Beka is that when the heddle is in the "up" position, the threads will all be tight, but in the "down" position, the top threads are tight and the bottom ones loose.  Also, I have always had problems with random threads becoming looser as the weaving progresses, and sometimes whole sections of threads becoming looser.

I am winding on without tension, the same way I do on my floor loom.  I would appreciate any advice people may have.  Thanks.

Comments

Thu, 08/30/2012 - 11:51

sequel (not verified)

I wind all my warps under tension.  Try winding your Beka warp maybe 3 times around the beam with packing or paper in between, then lock the beam and pull on the warp to tighten it on the beam.  This is called the Crank and Yank Method.  Be consistent with the strength of the pull, but on wider warps pull in sections that vary - right to left, left to right, center to sides, etc.

Thu, 08/30/2012 - 13:41

RuthHenriquez

Thank you so much for your reply.  I do use the crank and yank method, both on the floor loom and on the frame loom.  What I don't do is hold the warp taut while someone else winds, since I have found this method causes a tension differential between the outer and inner warp threads, due to the inner ones being pulled straight and the outer ones being pulled at an angle.

Even with carefully using the crank and yank method, however, the tension is still bad enough to barely be workable. I'm wondering if this is specific to Beka looms, or if there is anyone out there who has been able to get good tension on a Beka loom.  Or. . .is this a problem with all frame looms? 

Thu, 08/30/2012 - 19:10

sally orgren

although I have one and pull it out for demos from time to time. I think they are great for gentle handing of knitting yarns, but not so good when you do need something woven with tension. I hope someone can chime in and help you with your particular loom. I have noticed the tendency you mentioned, for one level to go slack on an open RH shed.

I DID want to address your comment about the crank and yank method on your floor loom. Because I warp solo, I needed to come up with a consistent process I can do by myself. I use to use the C & Y, until I came up with a modified method based on Kati Meek's system, using water weights (2 pounds plastic bottles) hung off the warp as I beam. That way I am assured I have perfectly equal weight/tension on each bout of warp as it beams. Also, depending on the height of the floor loom, or where you clamp your table loom to beam, you can probably beam a lot more warp before having to adjust the water bottles, vs the crank and yank. (The down side, you probably get less exercise walking from the back to front of your loom with the bottles. ;-)

I'll throw one more thing out there...I am not familiar with a Beka in particular, but in the past, I have clamped a piece of wood on top of my table loom's back beam, just under the warp, to raise the warp up as it feeds into the heddles to improve the shed. I don't know if this would help long-term on 3 yards. But it might get you by for finishing a shorter project, so you could re-beam if necessary?

Good luck—

Thu, 08/30/2012 - 19:48

RuthHenriquez

It sounds like tension can be an issue with this type of loom in general. . .thank you for that info.  

I went to Kati Meek's blog page. . .do you use a trapeze, or simply hang the bottles from your warp?  If you hang straight from the warp, how big a section do you use per bottle (1 inch? 2 inch?)

I have to say I have never had any tension problems on my floor loom, so I'm not sure I'd want to invest in a lot of equipment to weight the warp (i.e., a trapeze set-up); however, maybe just the bottles would be worth experimenting with. 

Again, thank you for your help.

Thu, 08/30/2012 - 20:09

endorph

I use empty vinegar bottles and 3 inch S-hooks from the hardward store to hang water bottles to weight my warp for winding on both my floor loom and my Flip RH loom. Depending on what I am warping I will use anywhere from 1 to three or four bottles. One or two for narrower projects like scarves,I try and keep my bouts between four to 6 inches in width. I do not use a trapeze set up just let'em drag along the floor.
Thu, 08/30/2012 - 20:30

KarenIsenhower

I've had great success with my faithful 32" Beka RH. I've been weaving on it since the 80's. I always wind the warp under tension. For a narrow warp, I have a weight that's just right - it's a cast iron frog that I found at a gift shop some years ago (doubt if you'll find one like it :). For a wider warp, I divide into bouts and use bricks (covered with cloth). For your size loom, it seems like 2 bouts would be enough. I stretch the warp out on the floor in front of the loom as far as possible, and keep moving the weight away as needed, as the warp is wound on. I hope that makes sense.

I've done lace shawls to rag weaving (for bags, not rugs) on this loom. With a little trial and error, I think you'll find a happy solution with your Beka.

Thu, 08/30/2012 - 20:43

RuthHenriquez

Thanks for this -- I do like the idea of using the S-hooks.  I will try weights using those. . .R

Thu, 08/30/2012 - 20:47

RuthHenriquez

Karen,  This sounds interesting as well, using weights on the floor rather than hanging weights.  I am willing to give both methods a try.  (I do like the idea of having a frog to sit on my warp, but doubt I can track one down anytime soon!).

Thu, 08/30/2012 - 20:58

Claudia Segal (not verified)

I had a Beka rh loom and could never get the tension right.  I finally sold it, nearly gave it away actually.  I bought a Schacht Flip and it's great.  I never have tension problems and wove 5 yds linen fabric last month.  It was the best investment I ever made.  

Claudia

Thu, 08/30/2012 - 22:13

RuthHenriquez

Yes, I've been eyeing the Flip. . .My floor loom is a Schacht, and I love it.  I think I'll try warping the Beka with weights for the time being, but work toward eventually ending up with a Flip.  Thanks for this.

Thu, 08/30/2012 - 22:18

debmcclintock

I love my Beka rh, it has given years of service.  I've wound on and used up to 90 epi using some alternative weaving methods. It holds just fine.  I think you just need to rethink how you are applying tension to the warp as you wind it on.  Also make sure your gear teeth are facing the proper direction (check the directions).  Sometimes folks put those RH's together incorrectly in the beginning and never figure it out.  The s hook suggestion given above is great.  also consider putting a couple of paper towel tubes around your front beam as you wind on to avoid the front teeth from catching.  The loom works great, you just need to adjust how you use it.  Deb Mc

Thu, 08/30/2012 - 22:30

RuthHenriquez

Thanks Deb, I will take this into consideration, esp. the suggestion about the paper towel tubes. . .R

Fri, 08/31/2012 - 13:55

sally orgren

Typically I hang them in no more that 2" bouts. It depends a bit on the fiber too...is it 8 or 36 epi? Attached is a photo from my most recent project, baby blankets at 45" wide, 8 epi, and you can see I have 6 bottles (x 2 pounds each) over the width of the 9 yard warp. With this method, I can beam a warp like this in under an hour, easily. I tie nooses around the necks of the bottles, and use a clothes pin to hold, for easy on/easy off.

I used to use the book method (a stack of big coffee table art books work great!) but migrated to the bottles as a refinement. The bottles hang directly from the reed in a straight line. I had to collect the warp into a single pile (or two) to fit under the stack of books for wide warps, so sometimes that fed into the reed a bit differently on the sides than the middle. I also don't have a lot of floor space front and back of my loom, so going vertical helped me solve that problem. (And I don't have a high ceiling for the full trapeze, so that is how I evolved to the water bottles for now.) As soon as I get more space, I am building a trapeze! ;-)

For my smaller looms, I clamp them to the back/flat end of the ironing board at the tallest setting so I have the greatest distance from loom to floor. (Be careful tho' — an ironing board can be tippy!)

And yes, you may notice I do not chain my warps. (I DO use choke ties.) If you are worried about tangles, just drop them into a baggie to contain them. I learned about not chaining warps at Convergence 2002 from Diane Mortensen, and have been a fan ever since.

Fri, 08/31/2012 - 14:14

sequel (not verified)

I weight my warps like this too.  Then I adjust with C&Y.  I use 1 lb. knitting machine weights or one pound fishing weights and s-hooks every two to three inches of warp width.  I do chain, but with lots of choke ties.  I'm going to guess that if you live in the middle of the country, the 1 pound deep sea fishing weights might be hard to find...

Fri, 08/31/2012 - 14:20

endorph

Thank you for the picture of your water bottle method - I may have to adjust my method a bit - I like what I see on your loom! I do chain my warp but realistically by the time I am winding the warp the chain is pretty much gone. I do tie chokes however! Tina
Fri, 08/31/2012 - 15:15

sally orgren

Diane maintained that chaining the way most of us do it puts twist into the bouts, especially noticable when doing long warps. And this can lead to greater tangling after you have beamed several yards. 

Daryl Lancaster has a method that rotates how you grab the bout to chain, so you are less likely to add twist to the bout.

I tend to default to the method that is the most "mindless", so not chaining was easier than remembering which way I was grabbing the warp as I chained. And not chaining saves time.

I have to give credit to ALL my instructors and guildmates over the years. I wouldn't be able to share these ideas if they hadn't taken the time to show me first.

Fri, 08/31/2012 - 15:55

Joanne Hall

When you have a small warp beam, you have to be very careful when you beam the warp.  On your floor loom, the warp beam is probably much larger (thicker beam).  That makes it much easier to get the warp on with an even tension.  So, when looking for another loom, try to find one with a thicker warp beam.

Joanne

Sat, 09/01/2012 - 00:59

RuthHenriquez

Thank you all for the information you've posted.  I very much appreciate your advice and good counsel. I have a lot to think about now: chaining (or not), weights (Sally, the photo is very helpful), S-hooks, thicker warp beam (thanks Joanne), possibly switching looms--and yes, I would eventually like to get a Schacht Flip loom, as devoted as I have been to the Beka, but for now I need to economize and work with what I've got.  I will start experimenting.

Sat, 09/01/2012 - 15:17

RuthHenriquez

Deb,

You wrote, "I've wound on and used up to 90 epi using some alternative weaving methods."  Where did you learn about warping that way?  I have a dvd which shows warping with 2 rigid heddles, which -- if I use 2 12-dent heddles -- would allow me 24 epi.  But I have not heard of being able to use much finer yarns on the rh loom.  If you know of any resources (books, videos) that teach this, could you let me know?  I do work mostly with finer yarns.  Thanks.

Sat, 09/01/2012 - 18:06

debmcclintock

No videos or books, I dropped in a regular reed and hung 2 shafts above my rh and used it like a counter balance loom.  The RH frame operated as the warp tension.   All were suspended from a frame I constructed around my RH frame.  My point was that the Beka RH is capable of handling fine yarns and holding tension just fine.  Sooner or later I'll dig out a photo and post it to this thread.  

Edit note:  I actually found a picture of my old turbo RH set up.  I had an overachiever for a woodworker.  One could actually put something togeather with pvc tubes and plumbing connections also.  Here ya go, this is the configeration I used:

 

Sat, 09/01/2012 - 19:17

francorios (not verified)

 

This is my trick for tension on my little Cricket rigid heddle. I would warp to a chair, then connect my warps to a book bag on the floor. The drag would hold tension as I wound onto the beam. One could have groups of weights for wider looms. I hope that helps. Have a good day!
Sun, 09/02/2012 - 14:46

RuthHenriquez

Amazing. . .thank you for finding and posting the photo.  It is most instructive!

Sun, 09/02/2012 - 14:48

RuthHenriquez

It makes perfect sense, and the photographs are really clear and helpful.  I will try it out.  Many thanks. . . 

Sun, 09/02/2012 - 19:03

Karren K. Brito

I had a recent Beka RH loom that had no rachet to hold the back and front beams , just knobs that twisted down.  As you turn the warp beam to wind on warp one side loosens and the other side tightens.  Ugh! I did many projects on it , it developed my 4 letter word vocabuarly.  I'm with Claudia, I got rid of mine and love my Leclerc Bergere 24".  It has metal rachets on both beams and a neutral position for threading and tie on.  

Part of your problem is that you are tieing on with the shed open (because the Beka has no neutral position) and that makes one shed 's threads longer than the other shed's.  You can overcome this problem by devising a way to hold your heddle/s in a neutral position ( no shed, all warps in the same plane)  while tieing on.

I'm not a fan of crank and yank, I use a method like francorios, a cement block in a bag that I drag across the floor or table.  Tension when you beam on must be equal to or greater than the tension you use when you weave.  If not the warp beam will be mushy (technical term) and the warps of one layer can cut into the next layer and create uneven tension, usually a few odd loose warps.

I love RH looms, but I think they should do what they are designed to do: hold the warp under tension so that I can open a shed and weave.

Sun, 09/02/2012 - 20:01

RuthHenriquez

You're right about the open shed, and my Beka loom instructions tell you to have the shed open in the up position while tieing on.  So thanks for that--I do think I can devise a way to tie on with the threads all on one level.  And also for the info about the weights providing tension at least equal to weaving tension.  I will keep that in mind.  

Mon, 09/03/2012 - 07:34

Sara von Tresckow

Back in the day RH looms often had only wing nuts or wooden screws to "hold" the tension.

The newer RH looms from most makers have ratchet and pawl tension and a "neutral" position for the heddle when warping or doing pickup. Having the heddle steady in neutral makes a tremendous positive difference in achieving even warp tension.

Honestly, those old looms without ratchets are practically worthless - I've never seen one that really did a nice piece of cloth.

Mon, 09/03/2012 - 13:06

debmcclintock

Loom designs differ. My Beka RH ( 80's vintage) has sturdy ratchet and panels to hold tension. It always seems as time passes the product brand name isn't reliable to describe the actual physical item. I agree that just wingnuts are not appropriate for holding tension.
Mon, 09/03/2012 - 14:54

RuthHenriquez

Yes, the ratchet is necessary, and my 80s Beka has it.  

Sara's point about tying on in neutral position is right too, and I'm feeling a little sheepish that I never thought about that and just tied on with the shed in the up position without really questioning the instructions.  That would not take care of all the tension problems, however.  Some of the problem has to do with sections of warp becoming looser than other sections as the weaving progress.  That added to the lousy tension from tying on in the up position makes the whole proposition untenable. I'm thinking the weights may help that.